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	<title>Comments for High End Piano Guy &#187;  &#8211; High End Piano Guy</title>
	<atom:link href="http://perarts.com/blog/comments/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://perarts.com/blog</link>
	<description>The world of high end pianos</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 25 Sep 2010 22:21:08 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on When is it not a Bosendorfer? by Eric</title>
		<link>http://perarts.com/blog/2009/03/when-is-it-not-a-bosendorfer/comment-page-1/#comment-7067</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Sep 2010 22:21:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://perarts.com/blog/?p=188#comment-7067</guid>
		<description>Thanks for your comment Mario. The main point of the post was to point out that after rebuilding, the name on the fallboard may not have much to do with what the piano actually is. Assuming that the qualities of the original builder are important, then effort should be made to maintain those qualities. Most clients don&#039;t understand the distinction and, in my opinion, many rebuilders don&#039;t consider the original characteristics of the instrument. I am talking about very high level instruments, such as Bosendorfer and others. Many lesser brands, including the name most often sought after in the used/rebuilt market, are frequently improved by the skilled rebuilder.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for your comment Mario. The main point of the post was to point out that after rebuilding, the name on the fallboard may not have much to do with what the piano actually is. Assuming that the qualities of the original builder are important, then effort should be made to maintain those qualities. Most clients don&#8217;t understand the distinction and, in my opinion, many rebuilders don&#8217;t consider the original characteristics of the instrument. I am talking about very high level instruments, such as Bosendorfer and others. Many lesser brands, including the name most often sought after in the used/rebuilt market, are frequently improved by the skilled rebuilder.</p>
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		<title>Comment on When is it not a Bosendorfer? by Mario Igrec</title>
		<link>http://perarts.com/blog/2009/03/when-is-it-not-a-bosendorfer/comment-page-1/#comment-7047</link>
		<dc:creator>Mario Igrec</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Sep 2010 23:06:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://perarts.com/blog/?p=188#comment-7047</guid>
		<description>A rebuilder faces a challenge. Working with each manufacturer&#039;s original parts requires slightly different techniques and sometimes different tools. Just as each manufacturer is thoroughly familiar and experienced using particular materials (plate finish, for example), a rebuilder is compelled to use the stuff he or she is familiar with. An average rebuilder is at a further disadvantage due to the much lower overall volume of work and having to be an expert at a very diverse set of skills, from woodwork to machining, to finishing, to fine regulation and concert-level tuning.

So the question becomes is the world better off with rebuilders who work with materials they understand and know how to control, or are original parts really the only way to maintain the genuineness of any given brand of piano? I am not talking about hotroding an instrument. If the answer is the latter, as you seem to suggest, then the only people who can rebuild a Boesendorfer are Boesendorfer people.

Also consider that manufacturers change their suppliers and implement product improvements that make today&#039;s product very different from the one made a decade or two ago. Renner uses felt from different manufacturers to make the &quot;genuine Hamburg Steinway&quot; hammer. Today it&#039;s a totally different product (with maple moldings) than it was 20 years ago (had mahogany moldings). So what hammers are &#039;genuine&#039; when rebuilding a 1990 Hamburg? Boesendorfer went throughy at least 3 styles of whippens in recent history (Schwander to Steinway-style being most notable). Premium Blues may actually be closer to the genuine, orange underfelt hammers, than many other styles of replacement hammers (Abel, Imadegawa, Isaac, etc). 

No question about it, the rebuilding work done by Boesendorfer is exceptional. But if performed to the same standards using different materials, does a rebuilding really invalidate the quality of the instrument? When it deteriorated to the point that it needed a rebuilding, the piano already changed. Do manufacturer&#039;s current parts and materials really make the piano that much more genuine than using other, slightly different parts of the same quality?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A rebuilder faces a challenge. Working with each manufacturer&#8217;s original parts requires slightly different techniques and sometimes different tools. Just as each manufacturer is thoroughly familiar and experienced using particular materials (plate finish, for example), a rebuilder is compelled to use the stuff he or she is familiar with. An average rebuilder is at a further disadvantage due to the much lower overall volume of work and having to be an expert at a very diverse set of skills, from woodwork to machining, to finishing, to fine regulation and concert-level tuning.</p>
<p>So the question becomes is the world better off with rebuilders who work with materials they understand and know how to control, or are original parts really the only way to maintain the genuineness of any given brand of piano? I am not talking about hotroding an instrument. If the answer is the latter, as you seem to suggest, then the only people who can rebuild a Boesendorfer are Boesendorfer people.</p>
<p>Also consider that manufacturers change their suppliers and implement product improvements that make today&#8217;s product very different from the one made a decade or two ago. Renner uses felt from different manufacturers to make the &#8220;genuine Hamburg Steinway&#8221; hammer. Today it&#8217;s a totally different product (with maple moldings) than it was 20 years ago (had mahogany moldings). So what hammers are &#8216;genuine&#8217; when rebuilding a 1990 Hamburg? Boesendorfer went throughy at least 3 styles of whippens in recent history (Schwander to Steinway-style being most notable). Premium Blues may actually be closer to the genuine, orange underfelt hammers, than many other styles of replacement hammers (Abel, Imadegawa, Isaac, etc). </p>
<p>No question about it, the rebuilding work done by Boesendorfer is exceptional. But if performed to the same standards using different materials, does a rebuilding really invalidate the quality of the instrument? When it deteriorated to the point that it needed a rebuilding, the piano already changed. Do manufacturer&#8217;s current parts and materials really make the piano that much more genuine than using other, slightly different parts of the same quality?</p>
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		<title>Comment on What does quality mean? by Eric</title>
		<link>http://perarts.com/blog/2010/05/what-does-quality-mean/comment-page-1/#comment-5051</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 07:31:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://perarts.com/blog/?p=896#comment-5051</guid>
		<description>Hi Peter
Thanks,  as usual,  for your comment. 

This equation in fact works very well for the maker with a dominating reputation for quality but trouble with consistency. People want to believe in a reputation.

My problem is that maintaining the reputation takes explanations.
To the average buyer the explanations make sense. After all piano building IS hard, and a company may have indeed made a large number of good instruments.

But the result is ultimately limiting, to the buyer and to the industry because there are makers out there that don&#039;t need explanations. 

Ideally the buyer should just be asked one question: &quot;do you like it?&quot;. If not, then perhaps another brand is more appropriate for your individual taste and communication style. The makers I try to bring attention to all agree with this philosophy.   

The more one travels the path of, &quot;well, try another:, or &quot;let it get broken in&quot; or &quot;our technician will make it right after all, 98% of....&quot; the more one risks actually driving a round peg in a square hole. 

There are makers of square pegs out there. To me, one peg does not fit all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Peter<br />
Thanks,  as usual,  for your comment. </p>
<p>This equation in fact works very well for the maker with a dominating reputation for quality but trouble with consistency. People want to believe in a reputation.</p>
<p>My problem is that maintaining the reputation takes explanations.<br />
To the average buyer the explanations make sense. After all piano building IS hard, and a company may have indeed made a large number of good instruments.</p>
<p>But the result is ultimately limiting, to the buyer and to the industry because there are makers out there that don&#8217;t need explanations. </p>
<p>Ideally the buyer should just be asked one question: &#8220;do you like it?&#8221;. If not, then perhaps another brand is more appropriate for your individual taste and communication style. The makers I try to bring attention to all agree with this philosophy.   </p>
<p>The more one travels the path of, &#8220;well, try another:, or &#8220;let it get broken in&#8221; or &#8220;our technician will make it right after all, 98% of&#8230;.&#8221; the more one risks actually driving a round peg in a square hole. </p>
<p>There are makers of square pegs out there. To me, one peg does not fit all.</p>
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		<title>Comment on What does quality mean? by Peter Sumner</title>
		<link>http://perarts.com/blog/2010/05/what-does-quality-mean/comment-page-1/#comment-5050</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Sumner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 05:44:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://perarts.com/blog/?p=896#comment-5050</guid>
		<description>Thought provoking as usual...

The last para is a little misleading though....in a way....
It isn&#039;t as if any particular piano is being foisted on an individual purchaser....they do get to choose....and hopefully they choose one they like...one that their technician has checked over....and one the their bank balance can accommodate...
Primarily they choose one that feels good to them as an individual...
It is something that they feel they can play music on and communicate.

The variations that occur are the result of a manufacturing system that has worked for them.....and they have probably made more good pianos than anyone else...
That last line I heard from Chris Martin iv of the Martin Guitar Company when someone asked him about variable quality in their 1970&#039;s production...

I hope you have, or soon will land, running hard in the business...good luck..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thought provoking as usual&#8230;</p>
<p>The last para is a little misleading though&#8230;.in a way&#8230;.<br />
It isn&#8217;t as if any particular piano is being foisted on an individual purchaser&#8230;.they do get to choose&#8230;.and hopefully they choose one they like&#8230;one that their technician has checked over&#8230;.and one the their bank balance can accommodate&#8230;<br />
Primarily they choose one that feels good to them as an individual&#8230;<br />
It is something that they feel they can play music on and communicate.</p>
<p>The variations that occur are the result of a manufacturing system that has worked for them&#8230;..and they have probably made more good pianos than anyone else&#8230;<br />
That last line I heard from Chris Martin iv of the Martin Guitar Company when someone asked him about variable quality in their 1970&#8242;s production&#8230;</p>
<p>I hope you have, or soon will land, running hard in the business&#8230;good luck..</p>
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		<title>Comment on 2010 NAMM part 4 &#8211; Bösendorfer and Yamaha by Anton Zanesco</title>
		<link>http://perarts.com/blog/2010/01/2010-namm-part-4-bosendorfer-and-yamaha/comment-page-1/#comment-5024</link>
		<dc:creator>Anton Zanesco</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 May 2010 20:55:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://perarts.com/blog/?p=815#comment-5024</guid>
		<description>this is a very relevant analysis of the situation.
I worked at the vienna part of Boesendorfer when kimball owned the business of running the name Boesendorfer.
to be honest as a person who knows that factory quite well
( and off course I am proud to have worked and trained there)
the yamaha organisation still has to overcome a majour cultural
difference in the aproach to the business of music.
and that is why Boesendorfer will be used until all knowledge of
180 years will be integraded into the yamaha name and Boesendorfer
will slowly be faded out. ( Kimball tried the same thing )
very much enjoyed your article.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>this is a very relevant analysis of the situation.<br />
I worked at the vienna part of Boesendorfer when kimball owned the business of running the name Boesendorfer.<br />
to be honest as a person who knows that factory quite well<br />
( and off course I am proud to have worked and trained there)<br />
the yamaha organisation still has to overcome a majour cultural<br />
difference in the aproach to the business of music.<br />
and that is why Boesendorfer will be used until all knowledge of<br />
180 years will be integraded into the yamaha name and Boesendorfer<br />
will slowly be faded out. ( Kimball tried the same thing )<br />
very much enjoyed your article.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Frankfurt Music Show 2010 by panama</title>
		<link>http://perarts.com/blog/2010/04/frankfurt-show-2010/comment-page-1/#comment-4973</link>
		<dc:creator>panama</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 May 2010 03:35:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://perarts.com/blog/?p=961#comment-4973</guid>
		<description>Good post - and good domain by the way!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good post &#8211; and good domain by the way!</p>
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		<title>Comment on NEXT!!! by Tinky</title>
		<link>http://perarts.com/blog/2010/03/next/comment-page-1/#comment-4609</link>
		<dc:creator>Tinky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Apr 2010 02:49:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://perarts.com/blog/?p=949#comment-4609</guid>
		<description>Can&#039;t wait to hear what&#039;s next on the horizon.........</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Can&#8217;t wait to hear what&#8217;s next on the horizon&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on Travels &#8211; Berlin by Tinky</title>
		<link>http://perarts.com/blog/2010/02/travels-berlin/comment-page-1/#comment-4332</link>
		<dc:creator>Tinky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Feb 2010 15:06:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://perarts.com/blog/?p=905#comment-4332</guid>
		<description>I want to go eat there NOW.  Well, maybe after the ice melts........</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I want to go eat there NOW.  Well, maybe after the ice melts&#8230;&#8230;..</p>
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		<title>Comment on Out of tune recordings by Eric</title>
		<link>http://perarts.com/blog/2010/02/out-of-tune-recordings/comment-page-1/#comment-4319</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 12:53:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://perarts.com/blog/?p=881#comment-4319</guid>
		<description>Hi Peter
Thanks a lot for the comment and for your open mindedness regarding our journeys. 

Some of the worst tunings are found on Bill Evans recordings. Yes, they were live club recordings etc but jeez, they are so bad! The reality is that the subtleties of the harmony used by people like Evans or Brubeck get lost when the tuning is so bad.  This issue is especially sensitive for me since I lined up a tuner for an important recording a couple of years ago. The result is a disc of really great music I can&#039;t listen to! Oh crap.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Peter<br />
Thanks a lot for the comment and for your open mindedness regarding our journeys. </p>
<p>Some of the worst tunings are found on Bill Evans recordings. Yes, they were live club recordings etc but jeez, they are so bad! The reality is that the subtleties of the harmony used by people like Evans or Brubeck get lost when the tuning is so bad.  This issue is especially sensitive for me since I lined up a tuner for an important recording a couple of years ago. The result is a disc of really great music I can&#8217;t listen to! Oh crap.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Out of tune recordings by Peter Sumner</title>
		<link>http://perarts.com/blog/2010/02/out-of-tune-recordings/comment-page-1/#comment-4315</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Sumner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 01:39:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://perarts.com/blog/?p=881#comment-4315</guid>
		<description>A great point Eric...Waaay back, I got hooked on Brubeck...Time Out...love the tune &quot;Sweet Meadow Lark&quot;...but I always wondered what there was about the transition from Brubeck to Desmond when the Sax takes over....Fuzzy blends into pure tone...sunshine.
Now I know that the piano is horribly out of tune...back then as a 14 year old it just sounded odd.
Enjoy your blog very much....don&#039;t always agree with your point of view...we&#039;re on different journeys...but I do respect your opinions.

Peter Sumner, Concert Piano Technician.
Modern era Steinway and Sons specialist.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A great point Eric&#8230;Waaay back, I got hooked on Brubeck&#8230;Time Out&#8230;love the tune &#8220;Sweet Meadow Lark&#8221;&#8230;but I always wondered what there was about the transition from Brubeck to Desmond when the Sax takes over&#8230;.Fuzzy blends into pure tone&#8230;sunshine.<br />
Now I know that the piano is horribly out of tune&#8230;back then as a 14 year old it just sounded odd.<br />
Enjoy your blog very much&#8230;.don&#8217;t always agree with your point of view&#8230;we&#8217;re on different journeys&#8230;but I do respect your opinions.</p>
<p>Peter Sumner, Concert Piano Technician.<br />
Modern era Steinway and Sons specialist.</p>
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